Sunday, June 19, 2016

A Little Bit of Drama...


There has been some drama going on at Sim Pearls regarding the fireplace mesh I used for my Column Fireplace .  The original creator recently joined that site (yesterday) to lodge a complaint saying that I stole her mesh and claimed it was mine.  She demanded that I remove my download from Imagine That! and issue a public apology to her.  I feel that I must defend my integrity against these false accusations.



  She went further in her remarks to say and I quote:

"You a liar and you know it,...so I reported you to moderators at Simpearls for stealing."

"You should be ashamed of youself...I will go every sim site I can find and accuse you of theft. I would have given my permission for you to make changes to the mesh but you didn't bother to ask."  

(Grammar and spelling errors are hers, not mine) 

I was never a creator at Sim Pearls, I only posted updates from Imagine That! in their Community Updates forum.

First of all,in my original post of the Column Fireplace I never said that the mesh was mine.  I said it was the work of another creator, but that she created it as a 1-tile statue which is true.  I also said that the texture map was flawed and had to be edited to make recoloring easier which, too, is true.  I also said I had to make changes in the mesh to make it fit the TS2 animations for fireplaces...again true.  All this is true.  I didn't steal anything or lie about anything.  I was completely up front with everything.  All I did was make the fireplace functional and to do that I had to make changes to the mesh.  Some of the things I didn't reveal was that the original object was cloned from the game's "On A Pedestal"...the Venus statue.  I know that because she didn't change the catalog description..it still refers to the "armless lady on a pedestal".  The original fireplace wasn't positioned correctly so you had to use cheats to place it against a wall.  She didn't alter the Material Definitions of the two subsets (which were the fireplace and the grill...there were no logs) so the fireplace takes the material definitions of the Venus base and the grill takes the definitions of the statue.

I originally made the functional fireplace several years ago for my own use and never intended to upload it anywhere, but I used it in an in-game snapshot of my Medieval Dining Room set and several people asked me about it.  I explained the situation about the original mesh not being mine and the changes I made to make to fireplace functional and everyone said they saw no problem if I would upload it as long as I would say all that in my download...which I did.  Why didn't I ask irelandforbrains for permission?  Because, as far as anyone knew, she disappeared when Black Pearl Sims closed and no one knew where to find her and the mesh had only been uploaded to the now defunct site, BPS.  I tried to find her at various TS2 sites but came up blank.  I even Googled her screen name to try to find her, but came up with nothing.  I didn't know her real name until she started harassing me about "stealing" her mesh and claiming it was mine.  Both things I never did.  She said that she created the fireplace for a person named "Melanie" at BPS.  She's even confused about this.  The fireplace she made for "Melanie" was called Squiggly Column Fireplace another statue and a completely different fireplace.  Then she started sending me more threatening messages.  I never mentioned who created the original fireplace to save her from being embarrassed from all the errors I found in it. But with her posts at Sim Pearls, and her request that I acknowledge her here for her mesh, all that has changed.

The original object was the creation of Irelandforbrains, or I4B and she is referred, real name Carol McNeill, created on 12-13-2010 and uploaded to Black Pearl Sims sometime in 2012.  I never actually used the fireplace in my game because it was a 1-tile sculpture and had issues when used in the game as evidenced by the following unedited screen shots.  You be the judge.

She claims that the fireplace only occupies two tiles.  As you can see, it occupied 3 tiles.  It only has a 1-tile footprint like the statue she cloned it from, but it occupies all or most of three tiles.  I made an error when I said it was 5 tiles because I hadn't looked at the original mesh in 4 years and I knew it was more than the two she claimed it wasI was mistaken and for that I apologize.


She further claims that Sims couldn't possibly walk through parts of her fireplace.  Well I beg to differ and so do the Calliente sisters...



She claims that the fireplace sits flush against a wall.   She didn't mention that is true only if you use cheats to place it there.


And the list goes on...

I had been working via PM with BetsyForArts, one of the Admins at Sim Pearls, trying to resolve the conflict privately and as adult as possible, but there was no appeasing Irelandforbrains.  Then to make matters worse, one of the Admins named Michelle publically posted several very nasty remarks against me, defending Irelandforbrains.  BetsyforArts privately told me that if those remarks weren't removed by Michelle, she or another Admin would remove them since they were embarrassing and it was against forum policy.  That was never done and the nasty comments continued despite several members siding against Michelle for her un-Admin-like behavior.  Finally I asked for the nasty, slanderous posts to be removed and when they weren't, I said I wouldn't be posting to their Community Updates forum again.  In the end, at my request, they removed all my posts and I am no longer a member there.

I hope everyone understands my position.

Ray

41 comments:

  1. I am so sorry! Technically, it is not hers. EA/Maxis holds all of the copyrights to all things Sims related. If they wanted to, they could force us all to cease and desist. Creators edit each others meshes all the time. You did your due diligence in trying to find her and she did not re-emerge until well after the fact. The item she made was decorative, at best, and, obviously. sub-standard. I would never want work like hers in my inventory. It is a waste of space and would never be used.
    As for Michelle.... obvious cronyism, and not worth losing sleep over. We'll just have to find another venue for you to post updates...

    As for me.... I'm on "Team Raynuss"!

    Lisa/Red Sonja

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    1. Thanks you Lisa for being a true friend. Welcome to the team.

      Ray

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    2. EA/Maxis knows from where the popularity of the whole Sims series stems: third party creators! There will never be a cease and desist order from EA/Maxis.

      In the entire history of The Sims, there has been ONE cease and desist order, from Marvel, who wanted to remove any competition to their (then) upcoming superhero game. Guess which game is still popular, many years later?

      Delete
  2. It's a shame some people don't know how to behave in a reasonable, civilized and polite manner.

    You know what, these days I saw a post by someone who fixed someone else's very flawed CC and I cringed when the original creator's name was mentioned...while of course it wasn't the intention, it sounded to me like "HEY GUYS [ORIGINAL CREATOR'S NAME] DID A HALF-ASSED JOB BUT DON'T WORRY I CLEANED UP THAT AWFUL MESS FOR YOU, NOW IT'S REALLY USEABLE AND IT'S NOT CRAP ANYMORE".

    So for me, it's understandable why you didn't mention her. But it's clear that you respect her and her reputation as a CC creator more than she does herself...

    Oh, and thank you for your work! I've found your website recently and I'm really excited with what I'm finding here! :D

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    1. Thank you for your response and thanks for downloading my stuff.

      Ray

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  3. I sent you an e-mail Ray. Please contact me. Thank you :)

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    1. Thank you Carrie. Email answered.

      Ray

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  4. I am on your side Ray..I hope I don't get booted off or banned from SP for saying that but I feel that I need to say that..I am sorry you left SP but under the circumstances I understand why..good luck Ray and I am a big supporter of yours I have a lot of your Creations in my Download folder lol..

    Broomhilda

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    1. Thanks Alta, I appreciate your loyalty.

      Ray

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  5. Oh Ray, what a horrible experience. I"m really disappointed that ultimately that's the way SP administration decided to go. I'm so sorry.

    I support you 100% and then some!

    I'm on team Raynuss too!

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    1. Thanks Toni, thanks for the support.

      Ray

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  6. There's absolutely no excuse for her behaviour...
    I mean she first worked on the mesh as a deco, alright but you can't accuse someone of STEALING your work just because they made it more functional and removed the buggy parts you didn't know how to fix.
    If I was her I would be happy someone cared enough for it to put their knowledge in and make it better.
    (I'm finding quite shameful the way she doesn't even remember of WHAT piece she's talking about, I mean...come on!)
    As for the admins at SP I just see a bunch of kindergarteners, really.

    I'm lurking your blogspot for a while and I can say you're not the type of creator who would steal something when you can do it yourself and much better, too.
    I'm joining your team Ray, in no way hers!
    Hermes

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  7. I'm totally shocked to see how this situation was handled by both the creator and SP. I honestly think this could have been resolved with one email but egos got in the way. Ray I understand 100% why you left, it's best to avoid drama and conflicts in your life than to have to deal with them unnecessarily. That has always been my stance. I'm just glad now that we've gotten to hear both sides of the story,(something that is quite rare these days). As long as you tried to do everything in your power to resolve the issue, then put it in the past and don't worry about it. Those of us who appreciate your work will suppport you. :)

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  8. Ray, Sorry this happened. I cannot understand it myself. I am collecting the BPS files to (at some point) place in Saving the Sims groups, and even though I have a policy statement of hers that implies her files can be placed at our groups, I am rethinking that. (and I have yours marked as probably not to be uploaded since you have this site!).

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  9. Hi Ray,

    I'm really sorry that this happened to you. Your integrity and generosity shine through in your actions and interactions. I'm on your side.

    And the idea that YOU, with your talent, would have to pilfer from someone else, is laughable.

    I am also very disappointed in SP. It sounds like they have fueled the drama.

    I hope you can let it go. Those who behave like that are not worth the time and energy they waste.

    Lisa CH

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  10. Oh, Ray, I am shamed by this person's attack on your reputation and your skill. You have my validation and trust. Hugs!

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  11. Oh Goodness Gracious! Your title says it all. Like someone above said-she should've been happy you made it so "shiny"...
    Peace be with you. (Team Ray member) :)

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  12. Hey Ray. So sorry this is happening. All I can say is that I know I4B disappeared even before BPS closed. I know this because I wanted to know if she had made her 1963 stove usable. No reply to my question and she has not repaired the item. It is still deco, so I resorted to using cheats and sliding an invisible stove over the item to make it work(worked great by the way). I detest this immature drama where one person can turn an entire forum upside down and ruin it for everyone. She should have thanked you for fixing her mess. I will say that I4B makes some wonderful retro appliances, very detailed, but all unusable. Fine for those that decorate only, but for those of us that actually play the game they leave a bit to be desired. That Michelle went off on you shocks me. She seemed like such a nice person and I am stunned by her behavior. If this costs me my forum privileges so be it... I call it as I see it. I have always been a fan of yours and always will be. Count me in on Team Ray. Now I've gotta go delete more files so I can fit your chimney set in! Lol I just love the set. Blessings, Katherine

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  13. I'm saddened to hear that you've experienced this. There is nothing wrong in what you did. Politely asking to remove a download is one thing, but threats and demanding a public apology? That doesn't fit the "crime" (which I don't see it as) at all. :/ Definitely on your side of this thing. It's nice to see that others are supporting you, too.

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  14. I agree with others that I'd be thrilled if a smart talented creator fixed something of mine that needed fixing! I'm sorry that I4B didn't see it that way. You're a good egg and you make lovely things :)

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  15. ::hugs:: to you! I'm so sorry this is happening to you. I've had a similar situation many years ago when creating for the Sims 1, I made a bad mistake, which turned out to be my own fault for being to naive to check creator's permission. Even though this was my own fault, I do know how it feels to be treated so badly. Despite me trying to apologize, the creator that I shared her animations in my own site (giving her full credit but not realizing she asked only to send people to her site), the site owner and many of her friends were horribly nasty to me. Even after apologizing profusely they all continued to trash me on every Sims forum available at the time, one of these forums had the nerve to kick me out, and refused to take down member gifts I made specifically for them. Some people are horrible and I can tell you from personal experience they aren't worth getting upset over. From everything you said in your post, it appears you done nothing wrong, and people shouldn't be trashing you like this - they shouldn't trash you regardless. I4B should have contacted you privately and tried to resolve it that way. But because she took it publicly without first privately contacting you, she's 100% in the wrong, trashing a person this way doesn't make the person being trashed look bad, it makes the trasher look horrible. I love your work, I use many of your creations in my game constantly, I hope a few not so nice people don't discourage you from continuing to create!

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  16. Don't worry about her, some people aren't worth the time...

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  17. I see you haven't posted much since this mess..I know you are busy with real life..and hope all is well..just hope you pop in once in a while to say hi..we all think about you..

    ~smiles~
    Broomhilda

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  18. I also think that she could have contacted you privately and tried to solve it in a civilized manner. I will miss your updates in SP, but I will visit applicants page to not miss any of your creations.

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  19. I am sorry that you had to go through that nasty experience. I have seen the posts on SP before the whole thread disappeared and was just shocked by the anger and hatred. I understand your reasons for not mentioning the name of original creator. Of course there can be different views of that, but if somebody wants their name mentioned (or have any other problems with your post), there is nothing easier than to contact you and politely discuss everything; nobody has right to treat other people like some dirty rags.
    You have done nothing wrong!
    Marioneve

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  20. Ray,

    I wrote this 9 days ago, but needed to proof it before I posted. Oh...the irony! Got to go! This PROUDLY BANNED OUTLAW has a realistically small Sim website to launch! What do you think of that as a title? :)


    Written June 21st 2015
    And so it continues...

    While I can understand I4B's passion about her creation, I cannot help but wonder what greater good came from trying to destroy you in the process. There are few creators who actually can improve upon an object and make it more functional. I know from experience that TS2 community is full of people who purposefully steal other people's work and claim it as their own, as well as people who make demands on creators as if they own them and even people who exist in a world of Sim Creator Royalty and exclusivity. I do not see you as one of those people.

    What is sad about this situation to me is that had she contacted you directly, simply to let you know that she is still around and would appreciate direct credit as the original creator, this all could have been avoided. I suspect, someone must have alerted her to the situation and it quickly got out of hand.

    Taking on someone else's creations can be a very iffy business. But, I personally would not be offended if someone gave new life to an old creation of mine, elevating my creation to a higher status by making it more useful for the community at large. While it has to be handled with tact (which I've seen many creators grow in exercising over the years), from what you've shared Ray, you did all that you could in the absence of the original creator. I also keep wondering when people will realize that every creator has a vested interest in any creation they spend time working on. I cannot tell you the number of times I take something on for personal reasons and it ends being something that demands more time than I originally thought it would due to the complications of the original mesh. As a perfectionist, I tend to work with the object until I accomplish what I set out to do originally. It can be something as basic as what I "thought" would be a simple recolor.

    I wonder when people will realize that by asking one simple question, most "drama" can be avoided. That question is "What can I do in this situation to serve the greater good of the community in my reaction?" I despise "drama" for the sake of people having a pity party at the expense of the greater good. It's a toxic thing that is rampant in the Sims 2 community. Or this idea of garnering sympathy in the Sims 2 community using emotional blackmail. I still to this day don't understand why so many in the community silently tolerate such things. I suppose it's that sense of entitlement people have in knowing they can garner the support of the "in crowd". All this does is make matters worse really and the expense of the larger community. By appealing to the communty in such a way, a person truly has very little character and zero integrity. Especially when it is far easier to simply let people know what you are feeling without unloading a sack of self-centered emotions on them. Personally, I can only fight for causes bigger than myself. I find that when it is about the self, people tend to hide the truth until they explode on the masses by blaming others. I for one don't like to be at the receiving end of such nonsense. No one should have to be. You should not be.

    I have come to appreciate and respect your integrity. While I'm not saying you are perfect (as if anyone is to include myself), but you operate from a place of standards which I do find refreshingly honest. I wanted to let you know that I have deep respect for your resolve and I am in awe of how you have built this wonderful website to continue sharing your gifts with the community in spite of everything.

    Stay strong and Take care.
    -steph

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  21. lol Steph..I like what you posted..and agree with you completely..

    Question on that title lol..?? Is that a title for you or for Ray lol..

    Broomhilda

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    1. Broomhilda,
      That title has been a source of pleasure around these parts. :) As to your question...it really is an homage to anyone who has been openly or secretly EXILED...I mean LIBERATED. So if the shoe fits!
      -steph

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  22. Cool Steph, I guess that would imply to me on a couple of sites lol..

    Broomhilda

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  23. Hey..this is Minena. I am so sorry you had to go through that thoroughly uncalled for and frankly, embarrassing fiasco at Sims Pearls. As far as I am concerned, no one owns a mesh..especially after it is imported into an EA owned program and converted to work with their coding. But, that said, you did nothing wrong in my eyes and the entire situation was poorly handled by SP admins. Ms Brains and Michelle should have both been censured and the thread locked and closed long before it got so totally out of control. Will miss seeing your updates there but I have your site bookmarked and will check often to see what fun things you are doing. Keep up the nice work and screw the nay sayers who think they own a piece of code.

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    1. However, since the model seemed to be taken from a free 3D model site, Ireland4Brains had no right to claim the model as hers, unless she applied massive changes to the item (bad mapping usually indicate downloads from free 3d model sites...).
      I think you did everything right here, Ray.

      Delete
  24. I am going to make one more comment..I feel that Michelle and everyone else that was involved in that mess should make a PUBLIC APOLOGY ..excluding the ones that tried to stop it from getting out of hand like tilly from CBS..not sure who else tried to stop it from getting out of hand..Sim Pearls should make them do a public apology..

    Broomhilda

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  25. Michelle (not the admin for SimPearls)Wednesday, July 06, 2016

    Sorry to hear about the treatment you received at SimPearls, I agree with everyone else, there is definitely no need for anyone to act like that and I4B and Michelle should be ashamed of themselves. You have my full support as well.
    Take care and stay safe.
    Michelle

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  26. It's such a shame this had to happen. Ray you are one of the most talented creators in the community and it is frankly incredibly petty that I4B took it this far. Hope it all works out well.

    Team Ray.

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  27. Ray, don't let a few people's petty attitudes get you down and cause you to stop creating. You make some of the best content there is and I'd be pretty darned sad to see you go. (I improved a few of I4B's meshes for my own use, with the intention of sharing at some point. They're gone now. :) )

    This "It's mine and you can't touch it!" attitude makes me cringe and anyone who has it should be ashamed of themselves. And that's from someone who makes meshes and textures from scratch - which means that I technically DO own a lot of what I create. But once I put it through SimPE and share it, it's not mine anymore - it belongs to whoever downloads it. They're free to edit/recolor/improve/clone/etc and that's the way it should be.

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  28. Simonut, here from MTS I read everything you said, hold your head up high, and continue to create and do what you love. As long as you know you did the right thing in your heart, not to worry about people who have no respect to handle any issue correctly.

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  29. Wow... Just wow...

    Ray, I WAS a huge fan of yours, but this makes me want to say I in awe of your honesty, patience, and integrity throughout this situation you are going through. I am more than just a huge fan now, and frankly the words escape me on what to stay here to truly show how I feel.

    I remember reading a post sometime back that you took a break from creating because of the 'ugliness' of some individuals. Frankly I can understand why you did it then, and yet I hope you will not stop creating. Everything you have touched has been magnificent, even if I did not download every single piece you have created (but darn close to it, I swear!). So to the person that blew all this out of proportion, I would say, just how old are you? From my perspective, and though I do not know this person, I would say its very childish behavior what has been displayed. I pray sincerely you will not let this jade your come back, and that you will continue to grace us with lovely creations. And frankly, if the shoe had been on my foot, I would have seen it as an honor that one of my meshes had 'upgraded' by a renowned creator such as yourself.

    Thank you for the love and attention you give every mesh. Thank you again, for sharing those creations with the rest of us who have not yet managed to create what you have created. And Thank you for having the integrity and patience to deal with this kind of ugliness. You are an inspiration to others in the community.

    So yes, I am on team "Ray" too!

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  30. Ray
    It is normally the one that is wrong that starts to yell without an reason. Don't really think much about it... you got your site and a lot of people that really like and appreciate your work. Sorry to read all this drama that she could avoid.

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  31. Ray be encouraged, your integrity and reputation remains untarnished. I applaud your grace under pressure and giving us an example of how to remain steadfast even when under attack. If I may quote Lady Silverwolf, "Thank you for the love and attention you give every mesh. Thank you again, for sharing those creations with the rest of us who have not yet managed to create what you have created. And Thank you for having the integrity and patience to deal with this kind of ugliness. You are an inspiration to others in the community." I couldn't have said it better!

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  32. I don't see why she had a problem. You gave proper credit and fixed it to function properly and fit properly in the game. There must have been something that appealed to you about her fireplace or you wouldn't have put all that work into it. Personally I think she should be grateful you took on the challenge of fixing all the problems which then gave new life to her original and more than likely your corrected version is in a good many games.
    I see what you did as a compliment, it's a shame her ego got in the way and she forgot to connect her brain before putting her mouth into gear.
    I am truly grateful for special creators like you who take the time to fix things for those of us who cannot create. You make our game so much better and more enjoyable.
    I LOVE the stuff you've created, it's awesome. I am sorry that you went through all that unnecessary drama and I hope you know that your fans already knew the truth. I suspect she was embarrassed at how many things need fixing.
    I do not know how to create things, only recolour them, but if something I recoloured was done badly I would be very thankful if someone took the time to show me what I had done wrong. I certainly would not have a childish temper tantrum.
    I have the utmost respect for your talents and I sincerely hope this person's ridiculous behaviour doesn't diminish your interest in creating.

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  33. I almost never comment on downloads or anything, but Ray, your stuff is a GODSEND. Please keep creating - you're an AMAZINGLY talented creator and the sims community needs many more like you! All this stupidity over who did what - does it even matter? Our game is ones step from abandonware and people are whinging over 'who wore it better' type rubbish? BAH. I side with you - and all fantastic artists who contribute substantially to expanding, fixing, updating, and generally creating for a game that EA never intended to be so loved and so full of wonderful work as it now is. Keep doing you buddy.

    -Terula

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